We take you to a little shop on St. Laurent where it all started.
People have a tendency to remember the particular places they visit through specific memories and encounters. Montreal, Canada for example always reminds me of three specific things, late-night poutine, the Jazz Festival and of course Schwartz. Schwartz is one of those unforgettable food memories you always long to relive, over and over again. For 80+ years Schwartz has been feeding hordes of Montreal’s food faithful with non other than their traditional smoked-meat sandwiches. It’s amazing to see an establishment so successful and so well known, stay the same. With the exception of their newly opened retail space, they have never renovated, redecorated or changed the way they do business. To this day, you still have to wait outside in a lineup for at least 30 minutes (if you’re lucky 15 minutes), only to be accommodated at a communal table depending on how many people you are with. But don’t get me wrong, it’s all worth it.
We had a chance to sit down with Frank Silva who has worked at Schwartz for 28 years, 11 of which he was the General Manager. It was interesting to meet the man that has been running one of Montreal’s landmarks for the past decade. Frank had quite the glow about him, almost as if he had no care in the world. This hard working man of Portuguese decent has earned his right to smile as the restaurant has been featured on Gourmet Magazine and on numerous Food TV shows.
In our interview with Frank, he tells us why people still line up to eat there, experiences he’s had as a result of the restaurant’s notoriety and why he won’t eat out at New York Delis.
We know that Schwartz has been open since the early 20’s, but how long have you been running Schwartz for?
Frank: I’ve been here for 28 years but for 17 years I worked as a counterman and a waiter, so basically for the last 11 years I’ve been the general manager.
So you moved up the ranks?
Frank: That’s right. I started out as a busboy in 1982.
How did you initially get into this business?
Frank: Well mainly because of my family… my dad actually used to work here, I had an uncle who worked here. By chance, I came in and just filled in on the weekend for somebody
And you fell in love with it?…
Frank: Well, its a great place to work at… It’s interesting the people you get from all around the world, Kerry Price was here yesterday, Trudeau used to be a regular, Chretien, you know, you name it, Halle Berry, Angelina Jolie, everybody comes to Schwartz’s
So tell me where does the name Schwartz come from, it’s such a household name here in Montreal but what or who is Schwartz?
Frank: Well it was the name of the founder, in 1928 Ruben Schwartz, a Romanian immigrant who started Schwartz’s. Schwartz himself was a single man who died in 1971 and he had no children so it’s always been basically the staff that runs the place, I mean we have an owner he’s a Jewish man also but he runs the place… the staff, they do everything and we keep the exact same recipe as Ruben Schwartz did, we have no freezers, we have no microwaves nothing. Just the old school way.
Throughout the years has there been competition popping up, trying to take you guys down?
Frank: Well we don’t have competition we have people who try to imitate what we do, and that’s exactly what it is, an imitation it’s nothing like ours. I mean, people try all over, there’s enough business for everybody as long as you put out a decent product, but if you want the best you can come to Schwartz’s.
Schwartz has been a successful restaurant since the 80’s yet nothing has changed since then. You keep the same recipes, the same methods, the same ways of doing business?
Frank: Exactly, it’s because we’re cooking on a large scale, home cooking on a large scale. We peel our own potatoes here, it’s not frozen potatoes, we peel our own potatoes in house. Bread’s fresh every morning, any left over bread goes back to the bakery and we get french bread. We’re so busy everything’s fresh. If you’re not busy, then you get left overs you freeze stuff.You see the line up outside? the line up is always there. It’s a high turnover, freshness and prices are fabulous because we do a lot of turnover right, so it’s hand in hand.
You have a lot of people coming from all over North America, in fact I just bumped into some people from Toronto that are outside waiting to get in. Why do you think it’s become such a household name not only for Montreal but for people around Canada?
Frank: First of all, we’ve been on all kinds of programs, Food Network in particular, so the name is out there and when people try it for the first time they don’t even know what it is and it just melts in your mouth. It’s great, it’s plain yet great food. I mean, it’s not for the atmosphere or the ambience, it’s very noisy, very crowded. It’s just for the great food.
When it comes down to it, it’s just smoked meat. Just really good wholesome food.
Frank: Exactly, Meat and potatoes. We keep it simple. That’s what people want, they don’t want the fancy stuff, they want the good food. We don’t have dessert, we don’t have booze, just one thing, smoked meat.
Tell me a little bit about the new retail expansion to the restaurant.
Frank: It’s a year old, a little bit over a year old. We actually expanded because it’s our building and we needed more room for refrigeration for production. Obviously we’re getting busier and busier and a lot of times we have to turn away people. We do a lot of catering and we sometimes have to turn down catering jobs because we can’t produce. The Jazz Festival for example wanted us o setup kiosks. We couldn’t produce, we said no, too many. Because everything is home-made. We produce a product in house.
We’ll from the looks of the lineups you have outside, it looks like you can afford to turn down some business here and there. Is business going great otherwise?
Frank: Oh Very good. Very good.The summer is fantastic and weekends also. Now with this new retail space open people don’t have to wait for an hour and a half outside, maybe half an hour
But I guess the waiting adds to the whole mystique of what Schwartz is about, people don’t mind waiting.
Frank: That’s true, but when it’s 35 below out there it’s tough
Now, with your career, did you know that you would have an interest in running this type of business?
Frank: Well after about maybe 10 years of working here as waiter, I saw that I had a few ideas that hadn’t been developed in here and I knew I could make it better. Our spices, we used to sell them in little plastic bags and now we have them in Schwartz branded jars. We also have 3 different spices now as well. Aside from making the place more marketable, I really enjoy the people I work with. It’s a great place.
One thing I notice about Schwartz is that all of the staff look like hard working blue collar people, but not necessarily people with tremendous restaurant experience.
Frank: Well we hire people with no experience, that’s the people I hire, I don’t want anybody with experience. Because the experience they learn is from me, they learn our way. If you wanna teach them, it’s a lot easier when they have nothing there.My best employees were trained in the house, and the people I have to let go are the ones who came with other experience in here and they had a few problems. but it’s part of the business. All our cutters are trained here
By you?
Frank: Not by me, usually other cutters… I can cut, but I have great employees who can teach. We have over 40 employees in here. I’ve been here 28 years but I have employees that have been here 40 years here
You’ve been featured on Food TV a few times now. Which experiences standout the most?
Frank: We’ll first off theres Christine Cushing, she’s wonderful… then, Rachel Ray. Actually she interviewed me here once and then she did another show where she vacations in Montreal and she did only one interview of all the best places – Schwartz’s
That brings me to another question. Montreal, is quite a different city from all other Canadian cities in that it has a European feel to it. It’s totally different from Toronto, totally different from Vancouver, & other cities in Canada. How would you describe the Montreal food scene in terms of what it has to offer and why is it so different?
Frank: Well, we were in Gourmet Magazine a few years back and they considered us one of the top cities in North America. New York, L.A and Montreal became another one and that’s in Gourmet Magazine right and they did a big spread on us. But I think it’s because of the different people that live in Montreal and of course Toronto has the same thing but we’re simpler in background, and we have a lot of European flavours and they’ve been instilled for a long long time. So.. I don’t know, I mean every city’s got great restaurants but I’ve been in a lot of cities and especially in the states and when it comes to good restaurants and food man, it’s very hard to beat Montreal and I’ve been all over the place man.
So looking abroad where would you say has comparable meat, I’m sure there’s nothing as good as Schwartz’s but comparable to Schwartz’s. New York City for example, they’re known for their cured meat are they not?
Frank: We’ll not really, it’s actually Pastrami. We went up against them and we won, but I think it’s not fair to compare because that’s Pastrami it’s not smoked meat, and in Toronto it’s not smoked meat it’s corned beef. So you’ve gotta compare apples with apples and I think that’s unfair. Our flavour is special, either you like it or you don’t. There might be people who prefer something else, but that’s our taste and I still believe our product is superior because it’s never been frozen, it’s fresh, it doesn’t have preservatives it’s not injected, naturally aged and everything, so it’s better for you. But some people prefer hotdogs over sausages so it’s a question of taste. I think nothing comes close to our products. Their products are good don’t get me wrong… but they’re different
Have you ever been to New York recently?
Frank: Maybe two years ago… I’ve gone four or five times
Where do you like to go to grab a bite to eat there?
Frank: I won’t go to the Delis. I don’t because they will disappoint me, they will disappoint me. I’ve tried them of course, you know you try it out of curiosity but then you won’t go to a Deli because its a little bit of a let down I guess…I think the Italian restaurants are very good and their steak’s are excellent as well… I go to Soho or Little Italy sometimes with a nice bottle of wine…great food, great shopping. Deli’s are for me…. like most customers, once you’ve eaten here it’s hard to try other stuff. People say, they’ve tried all the other smoked meats, and say “oh it’s very good.” Yea, but have you tried Schwartz’s? Try it, then tell me about it.
So what’s the five year outlook for Schwartz’s and for Frank Silva?
Frank: Well we’re always looking for possibilities to try and make it better for Schwartz’s but we get offers all the time for franchises, even Dubai and Brazil, you name it… We want to keep it here keep it local. Sometimes we think of opening up just a little spot to help with the line ups, probably for take out. Just a little take out counter where we still produce the product here. Those are some things might we might do in the future… eat and go, eat and run that’s what people want nowadays, everybody’s in a rush, take out is a very big business so we might get into that.
Interview & Photography by Chuck Ortiz.
Assisted by Antonio Fernandez.
Transcribed & Edited by Arianne Persaud.
Lineups Since 1928.
We take you to a little shop on St. Laurent where it all started.
People have a tendency to remember the particular places they visit through specific memories and encounters. Montreal, Canada for example always reminds me of three specific things, late-night poutine, the Jazz Festival and of course Schwartz. Schwartz is one of those unforgettable food memories you always long to relive, over and over again. For 80+ years Schwartz has been feeding hordes of Montreal’s food faithful with non other than their traditional smoked-meat sandwiches. It’s amazing to see an establishment so successful and so well known, stay the same. With the exception of their newly opened retail space, they have never renovated, redecorated or changed the way they do business. To this day, you still have to wait outside in a lineup for at least 30 minutes (if you’re lucky 15 minutes), only to be accommodated at a communal table depending on how many people you are with. But don’t get me wrong, it’s all worth it.
We had a chance to sit down with Frank Silva who has worked at Schwartz for 28 years, 11 of which he was the General Manager. It was interesting to meet the man that has been running one of Montreal’s landmarks for the past decade. Frank had quite the glow about him, almost as if he had no care in the world. This hard working man of Portuguese decent has earned his right to smile as the restaurant has been featured on Gourmet Magazine and on numerous Food TV shows.
In our interview with Frank, he tells us why people still line up to eat there, experiences he’s had as a result of the restaurant’s notoriety and why he won’t eat out at New York Delis.
We know that Schwartz has been open since the early 20’s, but how long have you been running Schwartz for?
Frank: I’ve been here for 28 years but for 17 years I worked as a counterman and a waiter, so basically for the last 11 years I’ve been the general manager.
So you moved up the ranks?
Frank: That’s right. I started out as a busboy in 1982.
How did you initially get into this business?
Frank: Well mainly because of my family… my dad actually used to work here, I had an uncle who worked here. By chance, I came in and just filled in on the weekend for somebody
And you fell in love with it?…
Frank: Well, its a great place to work at… It’s interesting the people you get from all around the world, Kerry Price was here yesterday, Trudeau used to be a regular, Chretien, you know, you name it, Halle Berry, Angelina Jolie, everybody comes to Schwartz’s
So tell me where does the name Schwartz come from, it’s such a household name here in Montreal but what or who is Schwartz?
Frank: Well it was the name of the founder, in 1928 Ruben Schwartz, a Romanian immigrant who started Schwartz’s. Schwartz himself was a single man who died in 1971 and he had no children so it’s always been basically the staff that runs the place, I mean we have an owner he’s a Jewish man also but he runs the place… the staff, they do everything and we keep the exact same recipe as Ruben Schwartz did, we have no freezers, we have no microwaves nothing. Just the old school way.
Throughout the years has there been competition popping up, trying to take you guys down?
Frank: Well we don’t have competition we have people who try to imitate what we do, and that’s exactly what it is, an imitation it’s nothing like ours. I mean, people try all over, there’s enough business for everybody as long as you put out a decent product, but if you want the best you can come to Schwartz’s.
Schwartz has been a successful restaurant since the 80’s yet nothing has changed since then. You keep the same recipes, the same methods, the same ways of doing business?
Frank: Exactly, it’s because we’re cooking on a large scale, home cooking on a large scale. We peel our own potatoes here, it’s not frozen potatoes, we peel our own potatoes in house. Bread’s fresh every morning, any left over bread goes back to the bakery and we get french bread. We’re so busy everything’s fresh. If you’re not busy, then you get left overs you freeze stuff.You see the line up outside? the line up is always there. It’s a high turnover, freshness and prices are fabulous because we do a lot of turnover right, so it’s hand in hand.
You have a lot of people coming from all over North America, in fact I just bumped into some people from Toronto that are outside waiting to get in. Why do you think it’s become such a household name not only for Montreal but for people around Canada?
Frank: First of all, we’ve been on all kinds of programs, Food Network in particular, so the name is out there and when people try it for the first time they don’t even know what it is and it just melts in your mouth. It’s great, it’s plain yet great food. I mean, it’s not for the atmosphere or the ambience, it’s very noisy, very crowded. It’s just for the great food.
When it comes down to it, it’s just smoked meat. Just really good wholesome food.
Frank: Exactly, Meat and potatoes. We keep it simple. That’s what people want, they don’t want the fancy stuff, they want the good food. We don’t have dessert, we don’t have booze, just one thing, smoked meat.
Tell me a little bit about the new retail expansion to the restaurant.
Frank: It’s a year old, a little bit over a year old. We actually expanded because it’s our building and we needed more room for refrigeration for production. Obviously we’re getting busier and busier and a lot of times we have to turn away people. We do a lot of catering and we sometimes have to turn down catering jobs because we can’t produce. The Jazz Festival for example wanted us o setup kiosks. We couldn’t produce, we said no, too many. Because everything is home-made. We produce a product in house.
We’ll from the looks of the lineups you have outside, it looks like you can afford to turn down some business here and there. Is business going great otherwise?
Frank: Oh Very good. Very good.The summer is fantastic and weekends also. Now with this new retail space open people don’t have to wait for an hour and a half outside, maybe half an hour
But I guess the waiting adds to the whole mystique of what Schwartz is about, people don’t mind waiting.
Frank: That’s true, but when it’s 35 below out there it’s tough
Now, with your career, did you know that you would have an interest in running this type of business?
Frank: Well after about maybe 10 years of working here as waiter, I saw that I had a few ideas that hadn’t been developed in here and I knew I could make it better. Our spices, we used to sell them in little plastic bags and now we have them in Schwartz branded jars. We also have 3 different spices now as well. Aside from making the place more marketable, I really enjoy the people I work with. It’s a great place.
One thing I notice about Schwartz is that all of the staff look like hard working blue collar people, but not necessarily people with tremendous restaurant experience.
Frank: Well we hire people with no experience, that’s the people I hire, I don’t want anybody with experience. Because the experience they learn is from me, they learn our way. If you wanna teach them, it’s a lot easier when they have nothing there. My best employees were trained in the house, and the people I have to let go are the ones who came with other experience in here and they had a few problems. but it’s part of the business. All our cutters are trained here
By you?
Frank: Not by me, usually other cutters… I can cut, but I have great employees who can teach. We have over 40 employees in here. I’ve been here 28 years but I have employees that have been here 40 years here
You’ve been featured on Food TV a few times now. Which experiences standout the most?
Frank: We’ll first off theres Christine Cushing, she’s wonderful… then, Rachel Ray. Actually she interviewed me here once and then she did another show where she vacations in Montreal and she did only one interview of all the best places – Schwartz’s
That brings me to another question. Montreal, is quite a different city from all other Canadian cities in that it has a European feel to it. It’s totally different from Toronto, totally different from Vancouver, & other cities in Canada. How would you describe the Montreal food scene in terms of what it has to offer and why is it so different?
Frank: Well, we were in Gourmet Magazine a few years back and they considered us one of the top cities in North America. New York, L.A and Montreal became another one and that’s in Gourmet Magazine right and they did a big spread on us. But I think it’s because of the different people that live in Montreal and of course Toronto has the same thing but we’re simpler in background, and we have a lot of European flavours and they’ve been instilled for a long long time. So.. I don’t know, I mean every city’s got great restaurants but I’ve been in a lot of cities and especially in the states and when it comes to good restaurants and food man, it’s very hard to beat Montreal and I’ve been all over the place man.
So looking abroad where would you say has comparable meat, I’m sure there’s nothing as good as Schwartz’s but comparable to Schwartz’s. New York City for example, they’re known for their cured meat are they not?
Frank: We’ll not really, it’s actually Pastrami. We went up against them and we won, but I think it’s not fair to compare because that’s Pastrami it’s not smoked meat, and in Toronto it’s not smoked meat it’s corned beef. So you’ve gotta compare apples with apples and I think that’s unfair. Our flavour is special, either you like it or you don’t. There might be people who prefer something else, but that’s our taste and I still believe our product is superior because it’s never been frozen, it’s fresh, it doesn’t have preservatives it’s not injected, naturally aged and everything, so it’s better for you. But some people prefer hotdogs over sausages so it’s a question of taste. I think nothing comes close to our products. Their products are good don’t get me wrong… but they’re different
Have you ever been to New York recently?
Frank: Maybe two years ago… I’ve gone four or five times
Where do you like to go to grab a bite to eat there?
Frank: I won’t go to the Delis. I don’t because they will disappoint me, they will disappoint me. I’ve tried them of course, you know you try it out of curiosity but then you won’t go to a Deli because its a little bit of a let down I guess…I think the Italian restaurants are very good and their steak’s are excellent as well… I go to Soho or Little Italy sometimes with a nice bottle of wine…great food, great shopping. Deli’s are for me…. like most customers, once you’ve eaten here it’s hard to try other stuff. People say, they’ve tried all the other smoked meats, and say “oh it’s very good.” Yea, but have you tried Schwartz’s? Try it, then tell me about it.
So what’s the five year outlook for Schwartz’s and for Frank Silva?
Frank: Well we’re always looking for possibilities to try and make it better for Schwartz’s but we get offers all the time for franchises, even Dubai and Brazil, you name it… We want to keep it here keep it local. Sometimes we think of opening up just a little spot to help with the line ups, probably for take out. Just a little take out counter where we still produce the product here. Those are some things might we might do in the future… eat and go, eat and run that’s what people want nowadays, everybody’s in a rush, take out is a very big business so we might get into that.
Interview & Photography by Chuck Ortiz.
Assisted by Antonio Fernandez.
Transcribed & Edited by Arianne Persaud.